User talk:MPF

Welcome to Wikidata, MPF!

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Best regards! Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 05:52, 19 September 2015 (UTC)

Archives

Archive to end 2022

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Category merge

Please do not merge a Category data item with a non-Category item. The merge result adds descriptions in multiple languages claiming that the item is a "Wikimedia Category page". In the case of Q38318377 there is also a gallery page on Commons, which cannot be linked if the category is linked. This is why the category was a separate data item. --EncycloPetey (talk) 21:50, 23 November 2023 (UTC)

I merged it because there was nothing - no link at all - from Q38318377 to Commons (to either category or gallery: I hadn't seen that there was a gallery), and it seemed completely pointless having the commons category unconnected to anything on its own orphan wikidata item, that also wasn't connected to anything at all either. It meant for example that you couldn't access the commons category from the wikispecies page, or vice-versa, or to en:wikipedia's page, etc. It really ought to be made possible to have links to both the category and the gallery from the wikidata item's right-hand column. - MPF (talk) 22:10, 23 November 2023 (UTC)

But when you merge a Category into something that isn't a category, you add in all the descriptions of the item being a Category in dozens of languages. All such descriptions are incorrect if the merge target is not a Category. It is procedurally incorrect to merge a Category with a non-Category for this reason. --EncycloPetey (talk) 23:07, 23 November 2023 (UTC)

Presumably they could just be deleted, though? It doesn't solve the problem of the inaccessibility of the Commons Category from other areas, which really is a problem. - MPF (talk) 23:30, 23 November 2023 (UTC)

I don't understand? You're suggesting that, instead of simply moving the link from one data item to another, two incompatible data items should be merged, and then all the data manually deleted from the merge? Why not simply move the link, and avoid having to sift through hundreds of labels and descriptions? None of the information on the Category data item needed to be transferred to the other data item because none of the data about the Category applied to the species. --EncycloPetey (talk) 23:48, 23 November 2023 (UTC)

The problem is, if I try to add Commons Category:Xxxx xxxx to the Multilingual sites list in Wikidata item for Xxxx xxxx (where it is needed for accessibility) without somehow getting rid of any Wikidata Category:Xxxx xxxx where it exists, then a robot will come along and revert it fairly soon. I know that when Commons doesn't have a gallery, but only a category, then links to the category from the Wikidata item are permitted (e.g. Q3308389 Pinus nelsonii has a direct link to Commons Category:Pinus nelsonii). Why then can't links to the commons category be allowed when there is a gallery, too? So, for Q38318377 Marchantia quadrata, how can I add a Multilingual sites link to Commons Category:Marchantia quadrata? It is needed. - MPF (talk) 00:07, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

Names for birds are not capitalized in Danish

Hi, you did this revert for the Danish name of the bird ravn. According to Dansk Sprognævn (the official regulatory body of the Danish language) Danish nouns are not capitalized. Not even nouns for species. At Dansk Sprognævn's official page you can see the noun for the item Northern Raven (Q25357) is officially written as ravn, not Ravn. I will change it back to proper Danish again. Penguin (talk) 14:59, 10 January 2024 (UTC)

They are capitalised according to IOC, and Netfugl. That is also what I have seen in Danish bird books. - MPF (talk) 15:06, 10 January 2024 (UTC)

But this is still not correct Danish for single nouns that are also present in Retskrivningsordbogen. IOC and Netfugl do not supersede the official regulatory body of the Danish language. It is fine to add them as "Also known as" but it is definitely wrong to remove the correct Danish word, spelling and capitalization. Penguin (talk) 09:49, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

Looking at the Retskrivningsordbogen entry, there is a clear difference between the two cases; the Retskrivningsordbogen is dealing with 'raven' as a general term, while IOC and Netfugl are dealing with the very different case of the defined official standard name of the individual species Corvus corax. Since the wikidata item Northern Raven (Q25357) is about the latter specific case rather than the former general term, then it is right that the listing there should be in the formatting of the specific, rather than the general. It is like the Retskrivningsordbogen itself: as the defined official standard dictionary, you give it a capital 'R', but if you were talking about spelling standards in general, you would say "i alle retskrivningsordboger", with lower case? - MPF (talk) 16:23, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

@Penguin: Here is the other relevant item: raven (Q8335). This should indeed be ravn in Danish (and I have just added it), while Northern Raven (Q25357) remains Ravn in Danish - MPF (talk) 16:48, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

Hello, bird names are common nouns, and common nouns should not be capitalised in English, Dutch, Spanish or Swedish either. I will revert your changes on https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q80362 . Sauer202 (talk) 08:38, 11 July 2024 (UTC)

Common nouns are not capitalised in many languages. Please do no use title case except for proper nouns on Wikidata. Sauer202 (talk) 08:46, 11 July 2024 (UTC)

They are capitalised in these languages; see the cited references in the vernacular names section - MPF (talk) 09:01, 11 July 2024 (UTC)

You have multiple people here who actually know these languages natively telling you your version is incorrect. Please stop and focus on something productive, thank you. Jon Harald Søby (talk) 20:29, 11 July 2024 (UTC)

As already pointed out to you, they are capitalised in the official Danish bird list. They are also likewise capitalised in several Danish bird books that I have, e.g. Europas Fugle (G.E.C. GADS Forlag). Wikidata uses referenced official standard authorities like these, not what you say for your own personal viewpoint. Same, by the way, applies to the official Dutch bird list, but not for example the official Swedish list, where only the first letter of the first word is capitalised, not subsequent words (e.g. 'Blek tornseglare' for Apus pallidus), and entirely lower case in text (see the notes on p.43, e.g. 'Troligen avser de svenska fynden atlantpetrell eftersom madeirapetrellen är mycket sällsynt och fåtalig'), which is why I did not add capitals to any Swedish names. Norway appears to have changed recently; in older versions of the list (e.g. July 2020 archive), they were capitalised, but in the current version they have been changed to lower case; I am happy to accept that and will no longer add capitals to Norwegian bird names following this recent change (which I did not know about until now) - MPF (talk) 00:02, 12 July 2024 (UTC)