Talk:Los Justicieros

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Los Justicieros/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: Grnrchst (talk · contribs) 12:33, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Reviewer: Spookyaki (talk · contribs) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

Hi! I'll be reviewing this.

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)

1. It is reasonably well written.

   a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):

2. It is factually accurate and verifiable, as shown by a source spot-check.

   a (reference section): b (inline citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism):

3. It is broad in its coverage.

   a (major aspects): b (focused):

4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.

   Fair representation without bias:

5. It is stable.

   No edit wars, etc.:

6. It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.

   a (images are tagged and non-free content have non-free use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):

7. Overall:

   Pass/Fail:

First readthrough, notes

Copyvio check looks good. Images look good. Might be good to include alt text (see MOS:ALT) but not a prerequisite for GA status. Made a few small tweaks myself. Overall, very cool article! A few points:

• The government of Spain responded with an authoritarian crackdown on union organising. In the Basque Country, lieutenant colonel Fernando González Regueral was appointed as governor, and he immediately ordered mass arrests of trade union activists. In Catalonia, groups of hired thugs known as pistoleros hunted down and murdered union organisers, while the police applied the ley de fugas to arrested workers. — Possible WP:NPOV issue (the terms "authoritarian" and "thugs" strike me as being a bit loaded) but depends on what the sources say. If that's their consensus, it's probably fine to keep this the way it is. Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

  Removed use of "authoritarian" and replaced "thugs" with "mercenaries", which I think is more neutral and accurate. Y

• From Ascaso, they learned more about the violence against the Catalan workers' movement by the pistoleros and the danger posed by police informants, which had provoked Catalan anarchists to close ranks and focus on large actions such as the assassination of Dato. — "Close ranks" here is a bit of a MOS:CLICHE. What does it mean precisely in this context? What did they do? Please clarify in the text if possible. Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

  Attempted to clarify. Essentially it meant that they distanced themselves from others, so as not to be vulnerable to infiltration. Let me know if more can be done here. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:08, 27 November 2024 (UTC)

  Looks good to me! Spookyaki (talk) 15:15, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y

• The term "repressive"/"repression" is used a few times in the text, and it generally creates problems. In some cases, it could be construed as an WP:NPOV issue, though when the actions are described, they do strike me as being repressive enough to warrant the term. However, the bigger problem for me is that it's actually an imprecise term, in some cases masking the nature of the repression and making it unclear what is being stated. I think in most cases, the term should be swapped out for a description of the actual repressive measures taken, if possible. This sidesteps the possible NPOV issue, since it allows the reader to come to their own conclusions, and increases the clarity of the language. Some instances where I might change it:
  • Overwhelmed by the repression, the CNT was driven underground and appealed for militants to fight back. → Overwhelmed by these actions, the CNT was driven underground and appealed for militants to fight back. Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)
    • Went with "Overwhelmed by these conditions". --Grnrchst (talk) 11:08, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y
  • They were given more details about the repression against the local movement... → They were given more details about actions taken against the local movement... Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)
    • Used "government crackdown", is that better or should I go with something else? --Grnrchst (talk) 11:08, 27 November 2024 (UTC)

      Also looks good to me. Spookyaki (talk) 15:15, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y

  • ...and rumours that Anido had been ordered to halt repressions against the labour movement, the possibility of which they dismissed. — This one is a bit unclear. What precisely was he ordered to stop? Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)
    • It's referring to the attacks against workers by both pistoleros and police. Funnily enough, "repression" is actually the word that Anido himself used to refer to this. In a meeting with a representative of interior minister Bugallal, Anido said: "Things being what they are, progress can’t be halted. [...] The government is just as implicated as I am in the repression and everyone needs to face up to their own responsibilities." If there's something else that's concise enough to say here, let me know. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:08, 27 November 2024 (UTC)

      Interesting, so that's actually what they ordered him to stop. I guess that's actually the most precise term then. Spookyaki (talk) 15:17, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y

  • Due to these repressive conditions, Ascaso informed them... → Due to these conditions, Ascaso informed them... Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)
    • Done. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:08, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y
  • Unable to quell the unrest, Manuel Allendesalazar resigned as prime minister and was replaced with Antonio Maura, who was tasked with repressing the Spanish populace. — Also unclear. What precisely was he doing? Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)
    • It was a crackdown against the anti-war and labour movements. Attempted to clarify. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:08, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y
  • Aiming to destroy the labour movement and win over the Catalan bourgeoisie, Maura stepped up the political repression of union activists. — Doesn't quite clarify either, and raises a few questions. Was he repressing the entire populace or just union activists? And in what way was he repressing the activists? Also, "stepped up" borders on MOS:CLICHE, though I think it's pretty clear what it means, so probably not an issue for GA. Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)
    • Paz went into more specifics, so I've mentioned those here. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:08, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y
  • Having now recovered from the repression... — I actually don't object to the word "repression" being used here in summary of the actions undertaken, but I think this instance could benefit by specifying who was doing the repression. For example: "Having now recovered from the repression undertaken by the pistolermos..." or something to that effect.
    • Specified government and pistoleros. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:08, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y
  • Does this make sense? Let me know if you have any questions or think I'm being unfair. Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)
    • I don't think you're being unfair! It's good to ensure things are presented neutrally, while also remaining descriptive. I think this has helped a lot with that. Let me know if there's anything more I can do. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:08, 27 November 2024 (UTC)
• ...half of which they sent to Bilbao and the other half of which was taken back to Zaragoza by Juliana. — Is this Juliana López or somebody whose surname is Juliana? Please clarify in the text. Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

  It's Juliana López. Clarified. --Grnrchst (talk) 10:42, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y

• But when Maura refused to hand the Ministry of Finance over to the Catalans, his government collapsed. — Why did this cause the government to collapse? Why would he have handed the Ministry of Finance over to the Catalans in the first place? Please clarify if possible, though I recognize that it may be more complicated than it's worth in an article that's not directly about this particular crisis of government. Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

  Basically the Maura government relied on the Regionalist League of Catalonia as part of his coalition government. When they didn't get what they wanted and pulled out, the coalition fell apart. I've attempted to clarify as "governing coalition", but let me know if there's something better I can do to clarify this. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:16, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y

• ...to the jubilation... — "Jubilation" seems like a pretty strong word, possibly MOS:PUFFERY. Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

  Changed to "celebration". --Grnrchst (talk) 11:17, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y

Not required for GA, but some other possible improvements

• Confederación Nacional del Trabajo should probably be italicized (at least in its first appearance) per MOS:NON-ENG. A translation might also be useful. Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

  Done. --Grnrchst (talk) 10:41, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y

• Other Spanish-language terms might also benefit from translations. Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

  Translated most of the other words, except for the newspapers El Comunista and Heraldo de Aragon. Can translate those if really necessary. --Grnrchst (talk) 10:39, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y

• Centro de Estudios Sociales should also probably be italicized. Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

  Done. --Grnrchst (talk) 10:39, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y

• The three then linked up... — I understand what this means, but "linked up" is bordering on MOS:CLICHE. I might change it out for something else, but since it's mostly clear what it means, I don't think it's a GA issue. Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

  Changed to "met". --Grnrchst (talk) 10:33, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y

• In order to get in front of the constitutional restoration... — "Get in front of" is also bordering on MOS:CLICHE, but understandable enough that it's not a GA issue. Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

  I wasn't sure how else to phrase this. Happy to take suggestions if you can think of a better alternative. --Grnrchst (talk) 10:31, 27 November 2024 (UTC)

  Eh, it's probably fine. I can't think of anything better myself. Spookyaki (talk) 15:21, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y

Overall, great work! I think there are a few things that still need to be worked on, but you've done an excellent job giving me an idea of what these folks were about. Hopefully we'll be able to get this to GA soon. Will perform the spot check in a bit. Need to take a break. Spookyaki (talk) 19:43, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

@Spookyaki: Thanks so much for the comments! I think this has really helped to improve the article already. Let me know if there's anything I've missed or if there's anywhere I can make further necessary improvements. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:18, 27 November 2024 (UTC)

Second read, spot check

Now for the spot check. Checking all sources. Notes on this read:

• Per the word "authoritarian", I think a different term should be used, since it comes from a quote from Buenacasa. I think that the descriptions of anti-union activity later in the paragraph (use of pistoleros, mass arrests) get across what happened more precisely without resorting to terminology that could be construed as biased. Alternatively, you could just include part of the quote. For example: By late 1919, metalworkers' and miners' strikes were becoming more commonplace. The government of Spain responded with a crackdown on union organising, which Buenacasa described as "authoritarian" and "vicious". Spookyaki (talk) 20:49, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

  Removed "authoritarian". You're right, the description of what was happening itself is enough. --Grnrchst (talk) 10:44, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y

• "Thugs" should probably also be traded out for some other term. Neither source describes them with that word. "Assassins" is used in Varela. Spookyaki (talk) 20:49, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

  Changed to "mercenaries", which I think might be the best neutral description of the pistoleros. --Grnrchst (talk) 10:43, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y

• Question, and this is genuinely from a place of ignorance. The article says that the constitution was restored, but the sources both say that "constitutional guarantees" were restored. Is that the same thing? Spookyaki (talk) 20:49, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

  Good catch! These are different things. "Constitutional guarantees" is used in the same way as constitutional rights. The constitution itself was technically still in force at this time, but the rights it guaranteed were suspended. --Grnrchst (talk) 10:30, 27 November 2024 (UTC) Y

Otherwise, everything looks good. I'll let you address some of the other issues. Once that's done, I think we can pass this. Thank you for your work on this article! Spookyaki (talk) 20:49, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

Third readthrough

Made some more minor ce adjustments, but looks good. I think I can pass this. Spookyaki (talk) 15:47, 27 November 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Did you know nomination

(

• Comment or view
• Article history

)

• ... that The Avengers attempted to assassinate the King of Spain, Alfonso XIII?

• Source: Paz, Abel (2006) [1996]. Durruti in the Spanish Revolution. Translated by Morse, Chuck. Edinburgh: AK Press. p. 22. ISBN 1-904859-50-X. LCCN 2006920974. OCLC 482919277.

• ALT1: ... that members of The Avengers fought against nationalists in the Spanish Civil War? Source: Varela, Raquel (2019). "Fascisms' road to power (1929–1939)". Critique. 47 (4): 616. doi:10.1080/03017605.2019.1678270.
• ALT2: ... that The Avengers robbed a Basque paymaster to pay for weapons? Source: Paz, Abel (2006) [1996]. Durruti in the Spanish Revolution. Translated by Morse, Chuck. Edinburgh: AK Press. pp. 26–27. ISBN 1-904859-50-X. LCCN 2006920974. OCLC 482919277.
• Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Amalberga of Temse and Template:Did you know nominations/Wang Hanlun
• Comment: Think the translated version of their name could make for some fun April Fool's Day hooks.

Improved to Good Article status by Grnrchst (talk). Number of QPQs required: 2. DYK is currently in unreviewed backlog mode and nominator has 46 past nominations.

Grnrchst (talk) 16:51, 27 November 2024 (UTC).