AHC: This Portuguese Empire

[Coluber]

I've been thinking about the best way to wank Portugal, and in order to do that, you need to change a lot about Portuguese society, but since I've got no patience for that, let's just change that which is really needed to create a large, multi-continental empire: a Gosh-darned good as heck army.
As I've said before, Portugal did not really have a modern professional army. In an age in which modern professional armies were emerging. In the country next door. Yeah.
Well, this is a wank, and I can go nuts, so I'm going bananas. (truth be told, I've got no choice but to be bananas as my military experience is limited to a single day in Vendas Novas after they figured out I had diabetes)
My military wank begins with Cristovão Leitão, who served in Italy with the Spanish Captain Guy that created the Tercio. As we all know, Spanish Captain Guy's work would result in what would be called the "moving castle".

Our hero, Cristóvão Leitão (let's just call him Leitão from here; for those of you who are immature, yeah, the word means piglet) is eager to introduce this revolutionary system to Portugal. But in our little wank, Leitão goes to the East Indies, and he learns that the tercios as invented by the Spanish Captain Guy just wouldn't work with the Portuguese. For starters, pikes aren't as cool over there as they are here. To be frank, they aren't cool at all, but they're especially useless in the East. What's more useful are guns. Also, Portugal can't spare so many men as to have a bunch of gunslingers surrounding dimwits with long pointy sticks. Especially not after a six month journey frought with peril. Portugal has to make do with less.
But the guns have their problems as well. They're matchlocks, and they take time to load, reload, maybe clean the barrel so it doesn't blow up in your face; you know; the usual. Common sense would seem to tell the Portuguese to shoot their guns, toss said guns aside, and then charge with their swords. Luckily, the Portuguese are using relatively smaller aquebuses, most of them made in Goa with a strong local influence.

Leitão is on good terms with the Viceroy (Which one? All of them!) so he tries to create a Tercio that's appropriate for Portuguese use. He gets rid of the pikemen and fills the block with gunmen. They shoot their guns and fight with their swords. Solution solved! But no, it isn't. You need spearmen of some sort to ward of cavalry charges, and other charges, especially in the open battlefield. Leitão tries to give light spears to the soldiers, so as to not overburden them. They have guns, but they also have these spears to stave off the enemy. It's still not right though. And then, one day, Leitão gets an epiphany. He sees a drunken soldier, having lost his spear, trying to shove his knife into the gun barrel in order to convince Leitão that he hasn't lost his spear at all - it just changed. The lush fails to convince Leitão, but Leitão remembers the tales of European hunters shoving knives into their gun barrels to create an improvised spear, and he wonderes to himself, "Can I use this?".
The problem however, is that the knife prevents the gun from being used. Leitão racked his brains to find a solution. And then it hit him. He decided that the stock of the Goan arquebus should contain within it a false barrel. It would be there that the knife would be shoved into. But it would be a special blade. Something the Portuguese would either call a "espigão", or a "farpa".

Thus the solution to the pike problem was solved! Leitão could now create his own version of a Portuguese Professional Army. The key weapon was found, though the sword was still essential.
Over a few years, Leitão would create the Conto Novo, a new model army for Portugal. Each individual soldier filling the rank and file would be called a Degredado (alternately a Conteiro, but that name wouldn't be used so much due to jerks replacing the o with a u).
The common Degredado would in addition to the gun and sword, be issued a solha (brigandine).

A helmet.

An adarga

And boots.

Boots for walking. Boots are gonna walk all over you!
That's about it for the freebies (I am assuming that the crown just offers equipment to the common soldier, along with pay - this is a wank after all.)
Some Degredados add to their equipment out of their own pocket. Those in the very front lines wear bevors.

While some others wear poleyns and other forms of limb armor (including Turkic bazubands). Officers would have more elaborate and just better equipment.
It must be added that in the future, the adargas are replaced with gauntlets for the left arm.

And then those are dropped altogether as well, but these changes occur centuries after Leitão's death.
Ranks are organized in a way that calls back to the old Besteiros do Conto, while attempting to be modern.
Degredado » Alferes » Anadel » Anadel-mor » Capitão (Captain) » Capitão-mor (Captain-major) » Capitão-Geral (General)
Leitão has changed Spanish Captain Guy's Tercio to something which the Portuguese can handle a bit easier.

And that's my attempt, with as limited a knowledge as I possess, to create a standing, professional Portuguese army. I did try to make it match with the time period, though inevitably, bits of it seem to resemble armies of the eighteenth century.
Please tell me where I goofed with this.

 

[AlternosMundos]

inevitably, bits of it seem to resemble armies of the eighteenth century.

i don't know a lot about military history so no comment. but this seems viable.

 

[Lusitania]

The point is that regardless of how much you want to wank Portugal there are physical limitations that need to be addressed. Physically Portugal was limited in size and always was threatened by is bigger neighbor the Castilian.

resolve both by increasing its size while limiting Castile growth. Look at the history of both Portugal from 1139 and Leon to understand where things could of gone differently. Castile still be a big player but not the dominant one. You could then have Portugal start its expansion into Morocco in late 14th century and continue into the 15-16th century.

the idea is that the expanded country both Iberia and North Africa be ready to supply its colonization efforts. The other factor is the avoidance of Jewish expulsion and promotion of both commerce and manufacturing. Such as the weapons and cloth. The inclusion of souther Morocco and canaries along with Madeira give Portugal a huge base for sugar production prior to Brazil/Caribbean.

the discovery of maritime route to west Africa provide additional income from gold and ivory of west Africa along with slaves to supplement Portuguese agricultural and infrastructure development.

that just to 15th century.

 

[AlternosMundos]

resolve both by increasing its size while limiting Castile growth. Look at the history of both Portugal from 1139 and Leon to understand where things could of gone differently. Castile still be a big player but not the dominant one. You could then have Portugal start its expansion into Morocco in late 14th century and continue into the 15-16th century.

would keeping Leon and Galicia independent somehow be enough to put Portugal in position to pull this off, at least in regard to Europe?

 

[Lusitania]

would keeping Leon and Galicia independent somehow be enough to put Portugal in position to pull this off, at least in regard to Europe?

The problem was that there was a pressure to consolidate to be stronger to attack the Muslims plus the various countries were always intermarrying and that eventually someone would die without heir and succession wars were normal.

 

[AlternosMundos]

The problem was that there was a pressure to consolidate to be stronger to attack the Muslims plus the various countries were always intermarrying and that eventually someone would die without heir and succession wars were normal.

In that case what do you think the best means of limiting Castile are?

 

[Lusitania]

In that case what do you think the best means of limiting Castile are?

The thing is that if Portugal gets Galicia and Leon then expands southward with expanded borders it will be almost equivalent to Castile and we don’t need to limit Castile and it can go about its merry way. But Portugal being much larger can maintain its own foreign and domestic policies without regards to Castile bullying.

plus now you have a stronger country that could expand into Morocco

 

[Terço]

I don't think that Portugal could be a global power, but a union first whit Galiza and then whit the Crown of Leon would change the demography of the kingdom allowing the Otl maritime expansion but also the birth first of large colonies that eventually would become large independent states, so Portugal as a global power in a certain time frame is doable but after a few centuries it would had been replaced by a series of lusophone states.
Astur-Leonese could be integrated into the portuguese language, that would be reinforced by the galicians, if the portuguese kings build universities in Évora, Coimbra, Salamanca and Santiago, I think that in due time Astur-Leonese dialects would become some sort of Eastern Portuguese, borrowing vocabulary from Portuguese and being confined mostly to rural areas if Portugal establish a university in Salamanca like Castilla did Otl.
Portuguese jews should become a model minority that's not overtaxed and latter something like the VOC would emerge from the community establishing commercial hubs in the Empire.
The Leonese nobility would be useful for a quicker reconquista, laying ground for an earlier settlement in Azores, Madeira and Canary Islands and the invasion of Morocco.
American researchers found that a rectangular section flatbow is equal or superior to an English longbow, so flatbows made of Elm that's relatively common in northern Iberia could become the basis of galician bowery and galician bowman could be a game changer in the wars whit Castilla.

Bringing Percheron mares from France to mate whit Andalucian stallions, creating a new breed (that exists, it's a breed called Spanish Norman) of war horses agile like the andalucian but sturdier due to the Percheron stronger bone structure, could led to better portuguese cavalry armed with lances and shorter flatbows that the ones used by the bowman that accompany the portuguese heavy infantry that for easier training was armed with a wooden shield, a falcata and a short spear for thrusting or a war axe for cleaving and slashing.

Almogavar units would be used for reconnaissance and harassment of the enemy supply lines, armed whit spear-throwers and falcatas.
The production of the sugar in the islands and the Sous area of southern Morocco, would provide a steady income of taxes to the Kingdom and the export of the "white gold" to Europe would finance the military development and further expansion down the coast of Africa.
Inheritance laws that favor the eldest son would prevent the minifúndio and the second sons could be inticed to join the army and navy knowing that veterans were rewarded with large swats of land in the conquered territories.
Morocco would be devided in large estates and the arabized population in Western Morocco, that survives the invasion would be sold into slavery in Portugal and used to work in agriculture and infrastructure, while the berbers in the highlands were left alone for the time being.
Larger estates would allow an agricultural revolution whit the introduction of the new world crops like maize, potatoes, beans, amaranth, in the future.
From Açores, portuguese sailors would reach Newfoundland almost a century before Columbus , laying the foundation work for Portuguese North America that would grow along Saint Lawrence river into the Great Lakes area but also south and Galiza and Asturies along with the Açores would provide a steady flow of settlers and probably a mix of portuguese galician dialect and asturian bable would become the basis of portuguese north american dialect.
OTL New England would slowly evolve into a large colony due to natural growth of the population and feed the expansion inland, I personally don't think that colonization south of OTL Delaware would be of interest, because Portugal would be by now investing in large scale sugar production in Brazil thanks to the development of the industry in Madeira, Canary Islands and Sous , and probably would be colonized by other european power, probably England.
Trying not to over extend in the Americas the portuguese empire would probably take at most an island like Jamaica or Porto Rico and focus in Africa and Asia.
In Africa, perhaps the portuguese missionaries convert the majority of the Wolof and Serer and western Senegambia becomes christian and the western african muslims are enslaved and sent north to work in the large estates of the Crown, Nobility and Church in Portugal and Morocco and to the sugarcane plantations in the Americas.
Further south, first the convertion of the Fon in Dahomey and then of the Kongos in the kingdom of Kongo led to the establishment of portuguese merchants and soldiers in the area and secured the sea route to Asia while a small settlement in the Cape, that in time would become a third Portugal after Portuguese North America and the Luso-Moroccan state, as a midway station between Europe and India , and then to the Malay world, China and Japan.
Using a bayonet in the firearms is a very interesting idea if it's done primarily outside of Europe leading to another leap in colonization until the other powers catch up.
Perhaps a mix between the advanced japanese firearms developed from the portuguese ones that are copied by the portuguese that ad the bayonet as a force multiplier.

Reading the threads of Viriato about Portuguese North America and Portuguese Cape and considering a Kingdom of Portugal incorporating Galiza, Asturies, Lleon, Extremadura and a stretch of Algarve to Huelva, its doable that both scenarios could occur simultaneously IF the other european powers were occupied with internal and external troubles that keep them focused on Europe for almost a century and even then the portuguese need to win harts and minds instead of Otl forced convertions.
Going protestant like England would probably help a lot and helping the ethiopian jews of the kingdom of Semien and their copt neighbors against the muslims, or accepting the nasrani christians in Kerala as equals would create goodwill that Otl was lost by the actions of bigots like Vasco da Gama.

 

[kasumigenx]

Prior to the changes in Phonology, Castilian and Portuguese were quite identical.

 

[Terço]

Prior to the changes in Phonology, Castilian and Portuguese were quite identical.

Until the XIV century Galician-Portuguese was shielded from Castilian by the different dialects of the Astur-Leonese language.
We say El Rey in portuguese and many think that is castillian but in fact is a Astur-Leonese heritage in the portuguese language and culture.

 

[kasumigenx]

Until the XIV century Galician-Portuguese was shielded from Castilian by the different dialects of the Astur-Leonese language.
We say El Rey in portuguese and many think that is castillian but in fact is a Astur-Leonese heritage in the portuguese language and culture.
View attachment 691919

The similarities between Portuguese and Castilian is like Occitan/Catalan vs GalloItalic.

 

[Terço]

The similarities between Portuguese and Castilian is like Occitan/Catalan vs GalloItalic.

I've heard portuguese people speaking Mirandês, that's an official language in Portugal, and it's distinct from portuguese, they say Eigreja instead of igreja in portuguese or Iglesia in castillian, so I don't disagree completely but I believe that the three languages, Galician-Portuguese, Astur-Leonese and Castillian are close to each other and share roots but just like Navarro-Aragonese shielded Catalan and Valenciano from Castilian in the east, Astur-Leonese shielded Galician-Portuguese in the west.
Obviously, as time passes Galician being close to Castilian and part of Spain is at risk and portuguese is not.
Catalan is closer to Oc than to the other Iberian languages and is the eastern Iberian branch of Romance languages, Navarro- Aragonese, Castilian and Astur-Leonese can be seen as central Iberian languages and Galician - Portuguese as western Iberian.

 

[Terço]

Something like this

 

[AlternosMundos]

Ngl not sure how relevant the history of the portugese language is.

I don't think that Portugal could be a global power, but a union first whit Galiza and then whit the Crown of Leon would change the demography of the kingdom allowing the Otl maritime expansion but also the birth first of large colonies that eventually would become large independent states, so Portugal as a global power in a certain time frame is doable but after a few centuries it would had been replaced by a series of lusophone states.

Portugal OTL was already a global power- arguably, the first. It projected power deep into the Atlantic, around much of coastal africa, the Indian Ocean, and the western Pacific.

Astur-Leonese could be integrated into the portuguese language, that would be reinforced by the galicians, if the portuguese kings build universities in Évora, Coimbra, Salamanca and Santiago, I think that in due time Astur-Leonese dialects would become some sort of Eastern Portuguese, borrowing vocabulary from Portuguese and being confined mostly to rural areas if Portugal establish a university in Salamanca like Castilla did Otl.

I will however admit more Iberian land would be useful.

Portuguese jews should become a model minority that's not overtaxed and latter something like the VOC would emerge from the community establishing commercial hubs in the Empire.

Always a fan of Jews not getting inquisitioned.

The Leonese nobility would be useful for a quicker reconquista, laying ground for an earlier settlement in Azores, Madeira and Canary Islands and the invasion of Morocco.
American researchers found that a rectangular section flatbow is equal or superior to an English longbow, so flatbows made of Elm that's relatively common in northern Iberia could become the basis of galician bowery and galician bowman could be a game changer in the wars whit Castilla.
View attachment 691909
Bringing Percheron mares from France to mate whit Andalucian stallions, creating a new breed of war horses agile like the andalucian but sturdier due to the Percheron stronger bone structure, could led to better portuguese cavalry armed with lances and shorter flatbows that the ones used by the bowman that accompany the portuguese heavy infantry that for easier training was armed with a wooden shield, a falcata and a short spear for thrusting or a war axe for cleaving and slashing.
View attachment 691905
View attachment 691907
View attachment 691908
Almogavar units would be used for reconnaissance and harassment of the enemy supply lines, armed whit spear-throwers and falcatas.

Don't know enough to comment.

The production of the sugar in the islands and the Sous area of southern Morocco, would provide a steady income of taxes to the Kingdom and the export of the "white gold" to Europe would finance the military development and further expansion down the coast of Africa.
Inheritance laws that favor the eldest son would prevent the minifúndio and the second sons could be inticed to join the army and navy knowing that veterans were rewarded with large swats of land in the conquered territories.
Morocco would be devided in large estates and the arabized population in Western Morocco, that survives the invasion would be sold into slavery in Portugal and used to work in agriculture and infrastructure, while the berbers in the highlands were left alone for the time being.

This all sounds smart.

Larger estates would allow an agricultural revolution whit the introduction of the new world crops like maize, potatoes, beans, amaranth, in the future.
From Açores, portuguese sailors would reach Newfoundland almost a century before Columbus ,

There is a lot of debate as to weather they found north america before columbus actually

laying the foundation work for Portuguese North America that would grow along Saint Lawrence river into the Great Lakes area but also south and Galiza and Asturies along with the Açores would provide a steady flow of settlers and probably a mix of portuguese galician dialect and asturian bable would become the basis of portuguese north american dialect.

I mean the colony existed otl it's just that england rolled up and said gimme.

OTL New England would slowly evolve into a large colony due to natural growth of the population and feed the expansion inland, I personally don't think that colonization south of OTL Delaware would be of interest, because Portugal would be by now investing in large scale sugar production in Brazil thanks to the development of the industry in Madeira, Canary Islands and Sous , and probably would be colonized by other european power, probably England.
Trying not to over extend in the Americas the portuguese empire would probably take at most an island like Jamaica or Porto Rico and focus in Africa and Asia.

This all tracks.

In Africa, perhaps the portuguese missionaries convert the majority of the Wolof and Serer and western Senegambia becomes christian and the western african muslims are enslaved and sent north to work in the large estates of the Crown, Nobility and Church in Portugal and Morocco and to the sugarcane plantations in the Americas.

Checks out.

Further south, first the convertion of the Fon in Dahomey and then of the Kongos in the kingdom of Kongo led to the establishment of portuguese merchants and soldiers in the area and secured the sea route to Asia while a small settlement in the Cape, that in time would become a third Portugal after Portuguese North America and the Luso-Moroccan state, as a midway station between Europe and India , and then to the Malay world, China and Japan.

Given the demographics of Angola, Mozambique, and SA otl, I don't know. Lusophonic? Sure. Not a 3rd Portugal (also wouldnt brazil be this anyway?)

Using a bayonet in the firearms is a very interesting idea if it's done primarily outside of Europe leading to another leap in colonization until the other powers catch up.
Perhaps a mix between the advanced japanese firearms developed from the portuguese ones that are copied by the portuguese that ad the bayonet as a force multiplier.
View attachment 691903
View attachment 691904
Reading the threads of Viriato about Portuguese North America and Portuguese Cape and considering a Kingdom of Portugal incorporating Galiza, Asturies, Lleon, Extremadura and a stretch of Algarve to Huelva, its doable that both scenarios could occur simultaneously IF the other european powers were occupied with internal and external troubles that keep them focused on Europe for almost a century and even then the portuguese need to win harts and minds instead of Otl forced convertions.

Going protestant like England would probably help a lot and helping the ethiopian jews of the kingdom of Semien and their copt neighbors against the muslims, or accepting the nasrani christians in Kerala as equals would create goodwill that Otl was lost by the actions of bigots like Vasco da Gama.

I mean, ttl'/your analysis has portugal tolerating a large jewish population anyway.

 

[Terço]

Ngl not sure how relevant the history of the portugese language is.


Portugal OTL was already a global power- arguably, the first. It projected power deep into the Atlantic, around much of coastal africa, the Indian Ocean, and the western Pacific.


I will however admit more Iberian land would be useful.


Always a fan of Jews not getting inquisitioned.


Don't know enough to comment.


This all sounds smart.


There is a lot of debate as to weather they found north america before columbus actually


I mean the colony existed otl it's just that england rolled up and said gimme.


This all tracks.


Checks out.


Given the demographics of Angola, Mozambique, and SA otl, I don't know. Lusophonic? Sure. Not a 3rd Portugal (also wouldnt brazil be this anyway?)
South Africa is perfect for portuguese colonization.
The climate is good for wheat, olive oil and wine and the lack of tropical diseases and vulnerability of the khoisan to european diseases and cavalry attacks ensures a rapid growth of the population.
The portuguese would take the cattle from the Khoisan and the portuguese taking khoisan women creates a mulatto population that would be integrated in the settler population.
Instead of waiting until the XIX century like the Dutch or British , a portuguese South Africa would fill the coffers of the Crown one or two centuries earlier.
I agree with the thread of Viriato, and portuguese South Africa would be the main supplier of troops to the portuguese empire in Asia and sending an army from South Africa to India allows faster and stronger response to the enemies because its less likely that part of the soldiers die during the voyage.
Natal region is good for sugar production and the portuguese would probably use the military reforms like the introduction of firearms with bayonets to conquer and enslave the locals making a huge profit because the workforce didn't need to be sent to plantations in Brazil if the sugarcane was grown close to their villages.
The natural growth of the portuguese population would create a large mulatto population and out of fear most of the tribes would migrate north to Angola and Mozambique causing havoc , so the portuguese would cause the same effect that the Zulu caused centuries after.
I consider South Africa better than Brazil because the portuguese settlers won't die due to tropical diseases, portuguese crops would be very successful, there is no african state strong enough to resist the portuguese and the ones that don't flee would be used in agriculture and latter in mining, not in another continent but directly in South African estates and mines.
Eventually, if gold is found in Minas Gerais before the discovery of the diamonds and gold in South Africa, thousands of white and mulatto South Africans would migrate to Brazil and settle there, so for me Brazil could be the fourth Portugal, only if that mass migration attracted by the gold rush pushes south and establish a strong portuguese presence in the Pampas, an area that is also suitable for large natural population growth and to the limit could ensure that no Europeans would be needed because the population would have been enough to ensure economical growth.




I mean, ttl'/your analysis has portugal tolerating a large jewish population anyway.

 

[AlternosMundos]

uh, @Terço it seems you forgot the post

 

[Terço]

uh, @Terço it seems you forgot the post

I just explained my point of view about the virtues of a portuguese colony in South Africa.
I think is there if you open the post.

 

[AlternosMundos]

I just explained my point of view about the virtues of a portuguese colony in South Africa.
I think is there if you open the post.

oh i didn't see it was in the quote

 

[kasumigenx]

I've heard portuguese people speaking Mirandês, that's an official language in Portugal, and it's distinct from portuguese, they say Eigreja instead of igreja in portuguese or Iglesia in castillian, so I don't disagree completely but I believe that the three languages, Galician-Portuguese, Astur-Leonese and Castillian are close to each other and share roots but just like Navarro-Aragonese shielded Catalan and Valenciano from Castilian in the east, Astur-Leonese shielded Galician-Portuguese in the west.
Obviously, as time passes Galician being close to Castilian and part of Spain is at risk and portuguese is not.
Catalan is closer to Oc than to the other Iberian languages and is the eastern Iberian branch of Romance languages, Navarro- Aragonese, Castilian and Astur-Leonese can be seen as central Iberian languages and Galician - Portuguese as western Iberian.

I think we can do to Castilian what happened to Occitan wherein a bloody dynastic dispute or bloody succession war destroys the language's future which happened after Eleanor married Henry II and the Albigensian Crusade, Occitan never recovered from the wars caused by Eleanor's marriage with Henry II and the Albigensian Crusade, wherein the people either died or fled to Catalonia/Valencia.

 

[Terço]

I think we can do to Castilian what happened to Occitan wherein a bloody dynastic dispute or bloody succession war destroys the language's future which happened after Eleanor married Henry II and the Albigensian Crusade, Occitan never recovered from the wars caused by Eleanor's marriage with Henry II and the Albigensian Crusade.

No Castilian kingdom, the kingdom of Leon endures as the main kingdom in Iberia and encompasses the western Iberian language continuum so Asturian-Leonese becames the central language, like Castillian is the central language in Otl Spain.
I see probably two solutions ;
1- Galician and Astur-Leonese became one language ( it kind of exists , is the Eonavian dialect) and force a language shift in the east of the kingdom and Castillian disappears.
2- Castilian and Astur-Leonese become one language ( again it exists, it's more or less the Cantabrian dialect) and force a language shift in the west of the kingdom and Galician disappears.
The kingdom of Leon would be insulated from the turmoil in Europe by two political entities, the Crown of Aragon and the Kingdom of Navarre and the Pyrenees, and if stability is achieved, capital at Valladolid in the northern plateau until it changes to Lisbon as the Discovery Age begins.
Jews are cherished by the King but muslims in Leon and Morocco become second class citizens burden by heavy taxes that disappear if they convert to catholicism.
It's hard to see which path the Kingdom chooses by then.
Morocco is obvious, because it's the continuation of the Reconquista, but after, slowly consolidate the conquest of the Americas or sea route to Asia?
Probably a mix of both and conversion of the west africans that practice tradicional religions and conquest and enslaving of the Muslim population , but learning from Islam, the muslim that accept Christ regain their freedom.
The Crown of Aragon goes full Occitan by conquest of the Duchy of Toulouse and Aragonese is replaced by the language of settlers coming from southern France to the Ebro valley.
Navarre maintains the control over the Rioja and the basque provinces on both sides of the Pyrenees and conquers Bearn so Gascon becames the main romance language and slowly absorbs Navarrese, but that variety of Gascon whit a strong substrate of Navarrese changes the name to Navarrese to distinguish between "French" Gascon and Navarrese Gascon.